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Matthew Murray, nghtmrchld26: The Confrontation At New Life Church In 2004

There appears to have been a connection between Matthew Murray and New Life Church in 2004…one that resulted in a confrontatio n. Perhaps this explains why Matthew chose New Life as a target. Even more significant, the staff at New Life allegedly warned Murray’s mother that Matthew might be “planning violence”.

The gist of the situation seems to suggest that two staff members told Matthew’s mother that he “wasn’t walking with the lord and could be planning violence”. From that situation, Matthew’s mother found his stash of “evil” items (music, books, video games) and confiscated them. It appears he may have blamed this on the folks at New Life.

Forum Thread Number One:

First Entry:

On 09/04/06 - Chrstnghtmr wrote:

Thread: Growing up in the nightmare of Bill Gothard and Charismatic Christianity  (short version) (Healing)  (Posted on: 04 Sep : 13:04)

I am 22 years old and I was raised in Bill Gothard’s homeschool program all the way through high school. I went to both the Basic and Advanced Seminars. My Mother was fully into both Bill Gothard’s programs AND the Charismatic movement. She followed Peter Wagner, Mike Bickle, Joyce Meyer, Ted Haggard of New Life Church, Cindy Jacobs, Dutch Sheets and any other person who was popular in the Charismatic movement at the time.

In addition to all of Bill Gothard’s insanity my mother was into all the charismatic/ ”fanatical evangelical” insanity. Her and her church believed that Satan and demons were everywhere in everything. The rules were VERY strict all the time. We couldn’t have ANY christian or non-christia n music at all except for a few charismatic worship CDs. There was physical abuse in my home. My mother although used psychotropic drugs because she somehow thought it would make it easier to control me(I’ve never been diagnosed with any mental illness either). Pastors would always come and interrogate me over video games or TV watching or other things. There were NO FRIENDS outside the church and family and even then only family members who were in the church. You could not trust anyone at all because anyone might be a spy.

At age 17, I decided to “go all out for Jesus” and do my best to practice christianity and live it out. I went to the bible to read for myself how one gets “saved.” I found several different versions of getting saved from the gospels. In John it was mainly “have faith” but in Mt, Mk, and Lk, it was as found in Mt 25, that you would have eternal life by doing good works(which of course is considered heresy). So I went to the books from the man that “had all the answers,” Bill gothard’s Basic and Advanced seminar textbooks.

What I found were all these other rules Irealized I could never live up to, yet, the man seemed to have a biblical basis for everything. In Februrary 2001 at age 17 I plunged into a dark suicidal depression all because I thought I had lost my “salvation” and somehow couldn’t live up to the rules. Every single hour of every single day, up until October 2001 I thought about ways of suicide and hating myself for not being worthy enough and failing God. I felt like there was no reason to live because I had lost my salvation and could never live up to the rules. In May of 2001, I told my parents I was depressed and they put me on 2 anti-depress ants(in addition to the other crap pills they had me on to try to brainwash me).

None of that touched this depression at all. Everyone prayed, they laid hands on me, spoke in tongues over me, I sought out every kind of christian spiritual help I knew of in charismatic christianity . I through away video games, a few movies, anything that could possibly be “bringing demons” that would cause me to lose God’s favour and make me depressed. I never told my parents I was suicidal however, that would have gotten me in big trouble, I just told them I was depressed.

In Oct 2001 I decided it had to end somehow, so I decided to simply reject the idea that Bill Gothard was infallible. The depression mostly cleared right up. I was still a little depressed because I saw other youth in another group doing so well and happy with life. That group was called King’s Kids.
King’s Kids is a youth ministry of YWAM.
I got involved with King’s Kids and went on missions trips with them.

At age 18, in 2002, I went to Youth With A Mission to do their “DTS” program which lasts a total of 5 months, the last two months you go on outreach. On the YWAM base several of the other young men smoked pot, looked at porn, listened to heavy metal, AND were involved in homosexual activities. 6 of the guys made a homosexual porn videotape together on the YWAM Denver campus but only one got kicked out because his face was on the video. 1 week before I was to head out on outreach, I was told by the YWAM Denver staff that I couldn’t go because I “wasn’t popular and talkative enough for missions work.” They admitted that I hadn’t done anything wrong, just that they had prayed and felt I wasn’t popular/”con nected” and talkative enough. I had already raised the $2600 for the 3 month course AND payed the $2200 for the missions trip(I did get a refund).

When I got back home it was back to the good old restriction and that is when I started having serious doubts about christianity . I got on staff with another group that is a program of YWAM called King’s Kids. I was on staff with them until mid 2005.

In early 2004, I was still living at home at age 20. I went to a charismatic conference at New Life church with my mother and her church. At the conference I got into a debate with two prayer team staff members. These two staff members watched me throughout the conference to find out who I was with. They found my mother and told her this story that went something along the lines of I “wasn’t walking with the lord and could be planning violence.” Two weeks later my mother brought over one of the pastors to search my room for “anything evil”(which included my Xbox video game and DVD collection). I tried moving all the video games, DVDs, and a few non-christia n books over to a friends house, but that woman was a church member. My mother and the church leadership called that woman, got into her house and basically destroyed at *least* $900 worth of property. I wasn’t involved in anything like drugs or anything like that. I just had video games, some books about other religions, DVDs and such.

After that incident my mother searched my room for the next 3 months EVERY SINGLE DAY. After that I decided it was over, that I had had it with christianity . Seeing how there are all these different churches and interpretati ons of the bible and what Jesus said, many different views on what a sin actually is and isn’t, different views on what God approves of, and all kinds of different views on:On how to get “saved” and how to stay “saved,” I realized that Christianity was mostly a big lie. Everyone has different ways of getting and staying saved and staying in God’s favor yet somehow there’s “only one God, one way to God and only one Word of God.”

I had already told my mother to lay off or she’d regret it. After that incident in 2004 I immediately went into all of Marilyn Manson’s thinking, ideas and music, believe it or not.

I found a LOT in common with Marilyn Manson and what he had to say, especially on his “Antichrist Superstar” album. I got involved in several other things too.

I never bothered to tell my King’s Kids leaders and friends that I had changed beliefs. I just stayed on KK Staff because I enjoyed going on outreaches and helping people. In 2005, I had written some poems about my experiences and sent them to some of my friends, 2 of which were on King’s Kids staff. One them got upset about it and forwarded it to the local King’s Kids director. He called me up and said he needed to have a meeting right away about “these e-mails you sent.” At the meeting I told him that they weren’t meant for him or anyone not on the list and that I didn’t see how any sin had been done. He admitted that I hadn’t done anything wrong by writing poetry, but he was still upset about it because it was talking bad about christians. He told me not to go to anymore meetings and that he would call me every other week to talk. He only called me the next week and has never called again. I had faithfully served them for a totall of 4 years, 3 of them on King’s Kids staff. I found out with them just who my friends really are.

After the 2005 King’s Kids I have not had any other affiliation with christian groups. however I’d say I left christianity in 2004.

Since leaving christianity I have gone on to the following:
Freemasonry- Scottish Rite, York Rite, Shriners
Everything Alesiter Crowley and Thelemic Magick, Marilyn Manson, Ceremonial Magick, Hermeticism, the Golden Dawn, Kabbalistic magick and studies.
Alice A. Bailey and her books, Lucis Trust, H.P. Blavatsky, Theosophy.

This story is kind of a shortened form. A LOT went on up until age 18, and then a lot happened at age 19(2003) to now.

____________ ____________ ____________ ____________ ____
Every man and every woman is a star

Editor’s Notes:

The following postings provide some poignant and troubling insights into Matthew and his thoughts. If one believes what Matthew has written, he asserts that he is bisexual…and has participated in “every sort of sexual perversion”… a statement which likely reflects some of the very religious judgments he sought to escape.

The last entry in this posting is perhaps the most significant… and perhaps one of the most troubling. I’ll offer a note of caution, in that Matthew uses some harsh and crass language in recounting an alleged conversation he had with his mother.

What is clear is his growing resentments and his determinatio n to effect a change. I contend his rejection of his religious ideology unfortunatel y didn’t include the ability to separate his newly chosen activities (drinking, sex, etc) from the construct of sin which had been ingrained in his psyche. While choosing to rebel, it is obvious he still loathes his actions though sees them as equal or superior to the hypocrisy and abuse he believes he experienced while attempting to live his faith.

Sadly, in the end, I suspect he couldn’t find a comfortable and comforting choice…hence his decision to end his life. It’s unfortunate that he apparently concluded he had no reasonable alternatives to the path he ultimately chose. I find it difficult to fathom being in that state of mind…but then that’s the primary reason for this exercise.

Let’s hope that our society will decide to be more proactive in the future.

Second Entry:

On 11/05/06 - Chrstnghtmr wrote:

Well I have to say with the news regarding Ted Haggard’s homosexualit y, methamphetam ine use, double life, lying to cover it all up for at least the last several years all while being “filled with the holy spirit”……..
I feel somewhat vindicated.

“There is a part of my life that is so repulsive and dark that I’ve
been warring against it all of my adult life.”

I’ve known many people, many people my age who’ve been abused and hurt by people in the “Holy Spirit Filled tongues speaking” “Deliverance spiritual warfare” “Holy Spirit annointed” Pentecostal/ Charismatic movements/gr oups/churche s.

Everyone’s saying “lets forgive this man and love him and pray for restoration”

I want to know, where was all the love, compassion and mercy for all of my supposed imperfection s growing up in church? Where was all the love and forgiveness from YWAM (where several of the missionaries were involved in homosexualit y) for me being “not talkative enough”? Where is the restoration, love, mercy, and compassion for the hell and christian nightmare I had to go through?

I believe that certain things have been exposed for the fraud that they are.
Many people will say “it was only one man.” But I say, “no, in my life, ZERO christians came to my aid. Most all the christians I knew in all the ministries and churches and groups I grew up in were no better than the rest of the world. I’m sorry, but this man does NOT need “forgive and forget, love and restoration. ” This particular group, New Life Church and charismatic movement in general has been in large part responsible for the christian nightmare that I’ve been through.

“You need to move on”

Believe me, I have moved on and now I can see and expose all the lies for what they are.

Christians will say “oh, but it’s only one man, there’s forgiveness. ”

“This doesn’t mean that God doesn’t exist.”

Didn’t say that it did. I fully believe in God, NOT this manmade christianity  , the false doctrines of christianity or other manmade religions. I believe in Light, Life, Love, and Liberty.

The Damage has been done……
Now, it is Christianity that will be mocked, laughed at, ridiculed, judged, and condemned by many………

____________ ____________ ____________ ____________ ____________ __________
Mister Crowley…….
Every man and every woman is a star

Forum Thread Number Two:

First & Only Entry:

On 09/04/06 - Chrstnghtmr wrote:

This is an interesting topic. In my house, prety much all christian contemporary  /christian rock and non-christia n rock music was Satanic. I was allowed to listen to christian sermons on christian radio stations, but no CD collections or anything.

It was in 2004 at age 20 when I rebelled against my parents and their church that I immediately went out and bought Marilyn Manson’s “Smells Like Children” Album. From there I got all of Marilyn Manson’s albums and went on to an assortment of metal and Black Metal groups:

Vital Remains, Slayer, Cradle of Filth, Danzig, Black Sabbath, Deicide, Cannibal Corpse, Emperor, Slipknot, Tool, Dark Funeral, Marduk, Gorgoroth etc.

I now have over 150 Metal albums, and yes I listen to many of them and enjoy the music AND the lyrics very much.

In my opinion, I think it’s obvious that enforcing such strict rules on teenagers and young adults can cause a rebellion.

All those rules drove me insane worrying that “demons would get me if I heard rock music in a TV commercial”( of course, TV itself is demonic). I would always look down on other church members who listened to contemporary christian music and always wonder “How come they’re not being punished? Why doesn’t God strike them down?”

I remember, the pastors children got into all kinds of christian rap and christian rock and it was promoted, yet I wasn’t allowed to have any of it. This issue helped to alientate me even more from other youth in the church. I always saw it as more hypocrisy in the church, that no one could agree on which music was acceptable and which music actually brought demons into the room you were listening in.

For me, that’s all in the past.

I went from sheltered no-music allowed child to hardcore black metal/marily n manson freak.(kind of like what happened to marilyn manson……)

And pastors aren’t getting into my place to go on “room raids” lol
____________ ____________ ____________ ____________ _________
Every man and every woman is a star

Forum Thread Number Three:

First & Only Entry:

Editors Note: The subject of this forum was “Forgiving Gothard”.

On 09/04/06 - Chrstnghtmr wrote:

There are different definitions of what “forgiveness ” is.

“Forgiving” does not mean “joining their religion/chu rch/group/cu lt/doctrines .”

Forgiving does not mean that it’s ok to abuse children nor that it’s ok to cover up child abuse.

Forgiving does not mean “going back and submitting” to someone’s so-called authority.

For me, I feel I can forgive my parents and family, however, I do not forgive their beliefs/doct rines and I will not tolerate further abuse. I believe that the truth needs to be exposed. People need to see through errornious and destructive doctrines and teachings including Bill Gothard’s.

Every man and every woman is a star

Forum Thread Number Four:

First Entry (one other exists but isn’t relevant):

Editor’s Note: The subject of this forum was “The Subculture of IBLP and ATI and Adapting to The Real Culture”.

I have had a very hard time adapting to “the real culture.” I started breaking away totally at age 19, I am 22 now. I have found it VERY hard to relate to the opposite sex and get and keep girlfriends, and of course getting laid and figuring out the mechanics of sex. A lot of times I have felt like such a loser when I see even other christian young adults getting married, having sex (outside of marriage), going out with girls all the time etc.

It is so hard trying to get “normal.” We were so brainwashed into being afraid of sex and pornography and thinking about sex or liking girls or their bodies. We were forbidden from becoming “men.” We were not allowed to be ourselves or think for ourselves or do anything at all that hadn’t already been dictated. And all the while we were told, “this is what God wants” “you’ll be blessed and live a long life if you do this” “the bible says that you will be destroyed if you disobey.”
“the holy spirit will give you gifts if you submit and obey”

I’ve asked the question of “why did I have to be raised in THIS church and with THIS family?” Why not a peacful mennonite church? or some other version of christianity where things were not so insane and strict?

Obviously, one of the common pieces of advice is to “get out there and live life,” which is good, but for me I have found a lot more.

In 2004, at age 20, I found a very interesting person who’s childhood was very similar to mine. This man was raised by the Plymouth Brethren, a strict fundamentali st christian group. His mother forbade him from even reading “non-christi an” william shakespear and other classical literature. this man was totally sheltered, heard the bible read every single day, his father was a preacher and evangelist. This boy even wanted to become an evangelist when he grew up. There’s a lot more that happened.

This boy who was raised in a very strict and abusive christian home was Aleister Crowley.

Discovering Aleister Crowley has helped me a lot in my life. This man wrote a book about his thoughts on christianity called “The World’s Tragedy.” It is well worth getting.

Of course, Aleister Crowley did a lot in his life.
Aleister Crowley said that “Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law. Love is the Law, love under will. There is no law beyond do what thou wilt”

Everything about Aleister Crowley just completely fascinates and captivates me. This man is like the antidote to what I was raised in.
I have also found a lot in all sorts of Occultism that has been very helpful.

The way I see it, is that christianity had it’s fun with me and… it’s all over.
In a way I’ve completely exploded out from christianity .
In a way it’s like I’m just about completely rebelling against christianity in any way that I can, but this is a little different of a rebellion.

Sure I’ve done drinking and sex, bi-sexuality  , bestiality, blasphemy, every kind of metal and black metal band, every sort of sexual pervsion I can think of that’s legal, etc. HOWEVER, I’m somehow different from other people who are of the “wrong crowd.” Most of my time is spent doing things other than the activities mentioned. A lot of my time is just spent in….occultis m/spirituali ty.

I guess I’m somehow different from “the wrong crowd” and most “rebels” and “wild” people in that I follow Aleister Crowley in this:

“That religion they call Christianity  ; the devil they honour they call God. I accept these definitions, as a poet must do, if he is to be at all intelligible to his age, and it is their God and their religion that I hate and will destroy.”


I’ve heard all the usual fake sayings and lines people will say.
Growing up I heard “it’s about a relationship  , not a religion!”
I’ve heard “don’t blame God for what people do” and “you’re just talking about a few people in christianity  , no group is perfect” “you weren’t raised in real christianity you need to join _________ ” “instead of looking at people you need to pray directly to God”

Guess what? I’ve got all those things covered. I prayed and cried out to God, and “called upon the name of the Lord” and I was lead to go this way. I believe that Jesus is God and I believe in what he taught HOWEVER, I don’t believe that much of today’s christianity follows Jesus. I understand that there are many good and nice christians, but I believe that the doctrines as a whole are false and a lie. I do not blame the one true God for the atrocity that is Christianity .

As I said before, I’ve prayed and read the bible, I called upon God to show me the truth, and this is the path I have found.

Don’t blame me just because I was shown a different path than christianity when I prayed and searched.

I would also say that I have yet to find any real spiritual power in any church or christian that was different from all other religions and spiritual paths. In the bible? Yes I read the bible all the time. I still will not follow Christianity .

I agree with Aleister Crowley himself when he said, “I do not hate God or Christ, but merely the God and Christ of the people whom I hated.”

____________ ____________ ____________ ____________ _____
Fiat Lux!
Every man and every woman is a star

Forum Thread Number Five:

First & Only Entry:

On 09/24/07 - Chrstnghtmr wrote:

I found this man to be a wonderful inspiration. In my times of difficulty in trying to heal, when I feel like my life sucks and that there is no hope for a rejected sheltered christian boy like me, this man’s life has given me a powerful hope and resolve to take a stand and to know that I’m not the only one who has been a victim of this kind of abuse and insanity.

Earlier this year I wrote a speech about this man’s life and gave it at a christian college in one of my classes. What follows is that speech/writi ng:

Edward Alexander “Aleister Crowley was born to Edward Crowley in England on October 12, 1875. Aleister Crowley’s parents were members of a strict group of Christians known as the Plymouth Brethren. As an infant Aleister Crowley was baptized by the Plymouth Brethren. Aleister Crowley’s parents raised him in this strict Christian setting. The bible was read and prayers were said daily.

The Crowley family was also wealthy because Aleister’s Dad was also a very successful brewer of alcohol. One can immediately see the obvious, apparent contradictio n in being an evangelist of the Gospel and a brewer of alcohol. This was a contradictio n that little Aleister didn’t fail to recognize. Nevertheless  , Crowley was encouraged by his father to love God and to want to grow in the Christian faith. Crowley was receptive to his father’s guidance initially. He used to love reading the Bible as a boy. As Aleister Crowley stated in his Confessions, “The underlying theory of life which was assumed in the household showed itself constantly in practice. The universe was created by God 4004 B.C. The Bible, Authorized Version, was literally true, having been dictated by the Holy Ghost himself to scribes incapable of even clerical errors.”

“The second coming of the Lord Jesus was confidently expected to occur at any moment. So imminent was it that preparations for a distant future — such as signing a lease or insuring one’s life — might he held to imply lack of confidence of the promise, ‘Behold I come quickly.’ “Earthly life was regarded as an ordeal; this was a wicked world and the best thing that could happen to anyone was “to go to be with Christ, which is far better”. On the other hand, the unsaved went to the lake of fire and brimstone which burneth for ever and ever” (Crowley, 1929-1930, p.38).
As a child, Aleister Crowley had desired to serve God and become an evangelist.

In May, 1887, when Aleister Crowley was 11 years old, his father died of cancer. This was to be a major turning point in young Crowley’s life. Aleister Crowley’s parents had sent him to a school in Cambridge, run by Plymouth Brethren. According to Aleister, this school was supposed to be run by Christians, they had constant chapel services, and a Reverend. However, Crowley documented that the school was dominated with liars, thieves, physical abuse, homosexuals, and a number of other forms of wickedness.  (Crowley, Confessions, p.63-67) The death of Aleister Crowley’s father and the hypocrisy he witnessed at the Christian school caused Aleister Crowley to desire to vigorously rebel against his Christian upbringing and against Christianity .
Aleister Crowley set out to figure out the best way to do this.

Aleister Crowley stated in his Confessions, “I was not content to believe in a personal devil and serve him, in the ordinary sense of the word. I wanted to get hold of him personally and become his chief of staff” (Crowley, 1929-1930, p.67).

When attending College, he was already proud of his homosexual behavior, drunkenness and drug use. While at Cambridge University, Aleister Crowley wrote a poem called “Alcedama- A Place to Bury Strangers In”. In that poem, Crowley wrote: “I was in the death struggle with self: God and Satan fought for my soul those three long hours. God conquered - now I have only one doubt left - which of the twain was God?”

Crowley answered his own question by determining that Satan was his god. He went on to write: “I had been almost overwhelmed by the appalling responsibili ty of ensuring my own damnation and helping others to escape from Jesus.” Crowley’s hatred for Christianity was summed up in a book he wrote in 1910 entitled “The World’s Tragedy.” In that book he made a statement that reflected his life’s goal:

“That religion they call Christianity  ; the devil they honour they call God. I accept these definitions, as a poet must do, if he is to be at all intelligible to his age, and it is their God and their religion that I hate and will destroy.”

In March, 1904, while traveling with his wife in Egypt, Aleister Crowley wrote the Book of the Law, which he claims was dictated to him by his guardian angel, named “Aiwass. In the Book of the Law Crowley was declared “The Prophet of a New Aeon,” a New Age where the old “Aeon of Osiris” would pass away and the “New Aeon of Horus” would be ushered in (Crowley, 1976). Aleister Crowley declared himself “The Great Beast of Revelation and labeled himself “666.” In 1920, Aleister Crowley used a building in Sicily, Italy, and called it his “Abbey of Thelema.” The “Abbey of Thelema” was set up for Crowley and his followers to practice magickal rituals and study the occult. After several scandals and a woman dying during a sex magick ritual at the Abbey, Aleister Crowley was expelled from Italy. After being expelled, Aleister Crowley became known internationa lly as “The wickedest man in the world” and newspapers everywhere were talking about him. Aleister Crowley went on to write many books on Occult and Magickal practices gaining many followers to his cause.

Aleister Crowley went on to become known as “The wickedest man in the world.”
Aleister Crowley would go on to write dozens of books on the occult throughout his life, promoting Black Magic and all forms of occultism, including astral projection, divination, ceremonial magick, witchcraft, human sacrifice, the Universality of Magick, and practically anything else that would help him achieve his stated goal — the destruction of the Christian faith. Crowley believed that Christianity was a gloomy religion, full of despair. He referred to Christianity as the “gloom.”

Rebelling against an oppressive and abusive childhood in evangelical christianity  , Aleister Crowley wrote many books on occult and magickal topics, become a leader in the world of occultism and one of the most infamous Magicians of the 20th Century. His works became practically it’s own occult religion, influencing much of modern occultism and influencing many people and followers, even to this day.

Every man and every woman is a star

Forum Thread Number Six:

First & Only Entry:

Editor’s Note: The subject of this forum was “”God’s Will” equals “Parent’s Will”

On 02/12/07 - Chrstnghtmr wrote:

I understand what you’re saying restored. My parents and their church were very abusive and they always used sayings like “touch not the Lord’s annointed” and “what does it say here?”(point ing to the ten commandments and Eph 6:1-3) “it says to honor AND OBEY! it didn’t say whether you think they’re abusive or not, it says to OBEY…..”

That’s just too bad because instead of a dead, lifeless, spiritually powerless criminally abusive christianity  , I found a new Law that says:

Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law

I realized that we all have a spark of divinity within us and that the answers can be found within ourselves, rather than from some hyopcrite Ted Faggard pastor or some abusive Gothardite tongues speaking fanatical church. Every man has a right to do his Divine Will that he has been given from the Divine(which of course, must be discovered first.)

It’s ironic that I was raised in a “godly loving christian home with two parents” and a church who all told me I would go to hell if I listened to even christian contemporary  /rock music and that demons would posses me if I listened to non-christia n music because I also found Marilyn Manson who taught me that, there is no heaven and hell and that I have no “original sin” that I need to be forgiven of and to kill myself over guilt over, nor that I need this false theory of salvation that christianity uses to force it’s system of enslavement, fear, tithing and abuse upon the world.

____________ ____________ ____________ ____________ ____________ _____
Every man and every woman is a star

Forum Thread Number Seven:

Editor’s Note: The subject of this forum was “Ignorance is innocence ? NO SEX! Education and ATI”.

First Entry:

On 06/25/07 - Chrstnghtmr wrote:

yeah, I’d agree encourager. I was always this shy timid little boy and always felt guilty for looking at or even talking with girls….
To get past all that……….real ize that you have nothing left to lose in this miserable life. Christians have raped and tried to take everything from within me. realize that, nothing really matters anyways, “Jesus”/”God ” certainly has not answered any of my prayers all these years….so if “God” has been there……then he obviously doesn’t have time….or is getting off watching all the suffering. Believe me, I’ve heard it all before, “oh, but he is right there even now!” “you just have to ask him”(as if I haven’t already done that) “you just have to turn your heart to him!”(so what…do I have to visualize my heart chakra linking to Christ?) “if you’ll only have faith and call upon the name of the lord!”(alrea dy done that a hundred times)

I can have sex with whatever and whomever I please. If girls or guys get offended that I ask for sex or play or that I ask them to get high or whatever…..t hen f*** them! I’m already going to Hell for watching the Simpsons and playing video games, leaving my parents church and a ton of other sh**, “God” certainly hasn’t said anything about it. I don’t have to worry about being turned down or feeling guilty anymore. Considering that watching The Simpsons will send you to hell, might as well watch any and all the pornography you can get your hands on to learn about sex. It’s not like “God” is sending a guy/girl to teach you about sex……..

I went to God just to see and I was looking at me
I saw that heaven and hell were lies

Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law
Every man and every woman is a star

Second Entry:

On 07/01/07 - Chrstnghtmr wrote:

Actually granolagodde ss, most people in this world are pretty f***ing stupid.

Most people are stupid enough to believe that their favorite politician would never lie to them, or that their government would never dare break any laws (read about COINTELPRO), or things like “the bible is the only thing that’s needed for education and the only source for truth.” People are stupid enough to believe that they need to follow a pastor and that pastors can be trusted(i.e. Ted Haggard). Heck, there’s even people who believe that they’re going to be raptured up into the sky and that some guy died and rose again for their imaginary “sins” that they think everyone in the world is guilty of and that everyone who is not a part of their church/relig ion and/or does not “speak in tongues” or desires to have sex is going to a lake of fire. Ha ha ha all you stupid people can suck my ****….cause for me, if I ever get sick of it all, suicide is always going to be there……

Sure, most people online are stupid, but most people offline are stupid also. Many people just go around believing what “the experts” tell them to believe.

What do you think about that granolagodde ss?

Of course there’s also those stupid idiots who think that online internet forums and e-mails are supposed to have perfect grammar and spelling………

____________ ____________ ____________ _____
Mister Crowley….
Every man and every woman is a star

Third Entry:

On 08/09/07 - Chrstnghtmr wrote:

This whole sex thing really discourages me. I didn’t learn what sex really was until age 19….unfortan ately not by hands on experience. I see all my friends and other people having sex, getting married and all while I can’t hardly even get a date even though I’m in excellent shape and “groomed.” I try to be nice and considerate and all yet I can never get a (female) date. I am at least able to get some male action but I wish I could just once be with a girl. It kind of sucks to be a young adult like this and to have never been with a girl.

Yeah, I know I suck and a lot of people hate me…but there is hope for getting laid by the end of this year.

I’m working with Marilyn Manson, Decide, Cradle of Filth, Slayer, and Slipknot on this one……and meditating on Liber OZ to come up with some solution, some way of getting laid with a female by years end.

I’ve realized that it really is all about the Beautiful People….all about everyone hating people like me who are the “horrible people.” Telling us “you suck”…”you can’t be this way”……all of this is your fault……all of this abuse you went through is YOUR fault…stop whining…..yo u’re just trying to shock…….you haven’t really been through anything……”a nd I don’t want you and I don’t need you don’t bother to resist or I’ll beat you, it’s not your fault that you’re always wrong…you weaker one’s are there to justify the strong….”

These days I’m able to have full confidence when approaching girls..I know that all the power I need is within me and that I am my own God…I don’t need Bill Gothard’s or some Charismatic Jesus People evangelical holy spirit bull**** system to have confidence and success. I didn’t know this as a homeschool sheltered teenage boy but I now know that much of christianity is just for the dominionists  /Council for National Policy groups to get money and further their political agendas. It’s just so that church leaders can get rich, have power over people’s live and take in tithes(so they can go buy Meth like Ted Haggard did or something to that effect).

Right now I’m listing to this Marilyn Manson song that says:
“Your christian world is an ashtray, we burn and coil like cigarettes…. .
the nature of the leeches…….th e virgins are feeling cheated…you’ ve only spent a second of your life…
my world is unaffected.. there is an end to this…don’t say it isn’t it’s true…..I went to God just to see and I was looking at me, Saw heaven and hell were lies…..when I’m God….
Scar scar can you feel my Power?”

I believe that as we ex-gothardit es/ex-christ ians heal we ill get this all figured out……Time’s going to wash away all pain….

____________ ____________ ____________ _____
I was born into this…..every thing turns into sh**
the boy that you loved is the man that you fear……
Every man and every woman is a star

Forum Thread Number Eight:

First & Only Entry:

Editor’s Note: The subject of this forum was “Crying all alone in pain in the nightmare of christianity ….”.

On 07/07/07 - Chrstnghtmr wrote:

Note: This is a writing for who deal with insane sh**. This is not a writing for those who “have it all together.” This is not a writing for those who “only want to think about happy things and feel better.” People condemn these writings just because they were “too dark” and didn’t want to acknowledge these things. Other people come and say things like “oh I know how you feel but if you just try hard to not think like this then you’ll feel better” or “if you just get counseling then things will be better, believe me, I know what you’re going through…..”
First, the seeing a licensed therapist routine has already been done…there’s no need to chant that tired line of advice.
Second, you probably do not know how people like me feel, so don’t act like it. If you think you know about what people like me have been through and want to understand, then here’s a razor blade. Drop me a line when you’re done and we’ll talk.

This writing was written down in early 2006.

For those of us who know about what it’s like to grow up in christianity …….
for those who can’t deal with hearing about people who have suffered at the hand of christianity …..
welcome to our nightmare…….

Editor’s Note: The following was posted in an entry on another site included in the first posting on Matthew but I include it again due to the above introduction provided by Matthew.

Crying all alone in pain…losing all reserve….I can’t wake up out of this nightmare……. .
Insane? Am I the only mother f***** with a brain?……..

Maze…psychop athic daze…I create this waste
Back away from tangents, on the verge of drastic
ways…can’t escape this place…I deny your face
Sweat gets in my eyes, I think I’m slowly dying

put me in a homemade cellar
put me in a hole for shelter
someone find me please, all I see is hate
I can hardly breathe and I can hardly take it!

lost…ran at my own cost…hearing laughter, scoffed
learning from the rush, detached from such and such
bleak…all around me, weak…listeni ng, incomplete
I am not a dog, but I’m the one your dogging…

I am crying here in a buried kennel
I have never felt so final
Someone help me please, losing all reserve
I am f***ing gone, I think I’m fu**ing dying

You all stare, but you’ll never see
There is something inside me……

Cut me! beat me! molest me! abuse me! @#%$ me! hate me! break me! Rape me! kill me! show me!
Here is my purity……
Enter this nightmare… ..I am willing and able and never any danger to myself
Knowledge in my pain, knowledge in my pain, just….@#%$ acknowledge all my pain, acknowledge all my

pain…..knowl edge in my pain……
Or was my tolerance a phase?
Empathy! out of my way!
I can’t die…..I can’t die…..I can’t die…..tranci ng out into another dark reality as the pain

fades away….my purity…..
You all stare, but you’ll never see
There is something in you I despise…..
have you ever seen God?……have you ever seen God?!
have you ever……

____________ ____________ ____________ _____
freak on my antics and give me a choice
it doesn’t matter if I give a sh** cause it’s sh** that you gave me
Every man and every woman is a star

Forum Thread Number Nine:

First & Only Entry:

Editor’s Note: The subject of this forum was “Honor Thy Parents”.

On 07/22/07 - Chrstnghtmr wrote:

First, there is nothing necessarily wrong with cutting. People like us are already going to hell according to christians. Why should we worry about all these little moral rules when we’re already going to spend eternity in hell for not following the “right religion”/”o nly true relationship with god?”

Why am I going to hell? First, I’m not perfect. Two, I’m an introvert. Three, I’m not popular enough to be a missionary with YWAM or any other church group. Four, I don’t pay tithes at all. Five, I don’t speak in tongues. Six, I don’t worship Bill Gothard. Seven, I’m bisexual. Eight, I don’t worship George W. Bush, Israel, and the Republican party. Nine, I believe that America was NOT founded by fundamentali st christians but rather founded for an esoteric purpose (as explained by Manly P. Hall in “America’s Secret Destiny” and Paul Foster Case in “The Great Seal”). Ten, I listen to non-christia n music(cradle of filth rocks!), watch pornography, and just simply cannot wait to meet this christian god/jesus so I can shove my d*** up his a**.

Really, there’s nothing wrong with cutting, nor with suicide, we’re already going to hell for some stupid sin and/or not following the “true version of christianity .” If you follow Bill Gothard but don’t speak in tongues and/or listen to that rock and roll devil music you are probably already worshiping Satan and allowing demons to possess/opre ss you and into your home. Seriously, I doubt cutting or suicide is going to “cause you to go to hell more.”

As far as dealing with parents….I don’t think the woman known as my mother really is my mother. She doesn’t act like it. My “mother” is just a brainswashed church agent cun,t. The only reason she had me was because she wanted a body/soul she could train into being the next Billy Graham, Bill Gothard, or Peter Wagner. I these idiots whine and complain about their broken homes and about how their mom wanted an abortion. Hell. I wish I was aborted but my mother wouldn’t dare do that. She had a “special plan from the Lord” for me. No easy way out for me. Almost every f***ing day and at every church service the pastors and our parents would tell me and the other youth that “God has a very special plan for this generation…. .don’t break any rules or you’ll miss out!!! Honor and OBEY your parents and the pastors(”god ’s annointed”) or your life will be cursed and you’ll open a doorway for demons!”

I haven’t been back to that church and group for a while. I told my mother earlier this year “listen here you little cu,nt, I’m not afraid of any of you christians, and I like screwing men, and I wouldn’t mind having a threesome in front of you and dad……hell….. I jack off right here in front of you !@#$%….I’m not afraid of any of your copied wannabe new age charismatic church prophetic powers” and then I told her “listen, I’d be glad to face off against any of your fake church prophetsm, we’ll see who’s spirituality is REAL…..c,unt ”

She just ran over to her room and I went back to my place. I already told her “hey, bit,ch, using drugs, alcohol and having gay sex, I’m just trying to do what any Christian pastor would do, at least I’m not doing meth like Ted Haggard…but maybe I will try it and maybe I’ll just OD on stuff just so I don’t have to deal with you anymore……”

Yeah….she’s left me alone ever since. Point is, don’t let these motherf***er s brainwash you….they lie and live double lives while claiming to “have the true way.” The most “spiritual power” these christians have is lower psychism and the altered states of mind that they work themselves into with their praise and worship. No, God doesn’t give you cancer when you go out and have sex, or get drunk, or smoke a joint, or stop paying tithes. No, demons don’t appear in your bedroom at night and posses your mind because you went to a gay dance club or called your mother a c,unt. In fact……none of that sh,it happens. I’ve left several messages for the christian god to “speak to me” if I’m on the wrong path with my life…….it’s been over 2 years and all I ever get spiritualy is to stay on the path that i’m on. I even have one of the prayers from 2004 that I wrote down. No christian or bill gothard god/Jesus has gotten back to me, and yes, I do still read the bible on occassion as well as many other spiritual texts.

Have fun, live life and don’t let these christian c,unts brainwash you. Cut if you will, think about suicide if you will, go to church if you will, be mormon if you will, get drunk and high and have sex if you will. Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law.

____________ ____________ ____________ ____________ ____
Mister Crowley…..
Every man and every woman is a star

Cross-posted at Thought Theater

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5 Responses to “Matthew Murray, nghtmrchld26: The Confrontation At New Life Church In 2004”

  1. As much as Matthew Murray’s actions were wrong, most of what he wrote about his upbringing rings true. I know people who were raised under Gothard’s “principles” and given what the Gothard people believe and do, it is not at all surprising to me that Murray reacted in this manner. It’s almost to be expected. His parents and Gothard and his people should all, in my view, be prosecuted.

  2. Although I was not raised within his Church or system, I attended two Gothard institutes at about 19 years of age (mid-seventi es). They were very helpful to me as I had just become a Christian. They were very practical and offered what seemed like very good advice for growing in faith and avoiding the pitfalls of life. Nothing to go shoot people dead or to kill oneself over. Then again, I went off, soon after, into a more mainstream, non-pentecos tal demonination that was far less rules oriented than this young man went through.

    I say this not as a rebuttal to what this young man went through. Merely to provide my own personal perspective. Nothing I saw or heard there was worthy of prosecution. Then again, that was before this young man was born. The Gothard thing might have changed in its teachings since I last went.

    Anyway, very sad.

  3. Another observation. The two Gothard institutes that I attended, were attended by thousands, perhaps tens of thousands of people. These were one day affairs and only one location. There must be hundreds of thousands, if not millions of young Christians that attended these things. One of them decided that the appropriate, Marilyn Manson soaked approach was to take guns to some Church locations and kill people. Clearly this young man is quite atypical. Unique, one might say. How many young people from these Church groups grow up basically happy, well adjusted, non-mass murdering adults?

    Does one mass-murdere r tip the scales and condemn the Christian Right? I don’t think so.

    I’m not saying that there isn’t plenty of guilt to spread around, assuming that all that Matthew says is true. I’m just saying that there is no direct, cause–>effec t relationship between being raised in a Christian family and Christian Right Church, on the one hand, and ending up with a mass-murderi ng suicidal killer on the other.

  4. “me”…

    I think you’re probably remembering the Gothard seminar that many mainstream Xtians think of from “way back”. Since you attended in the 70’s, Gothard honed his teachings to a very strict system of biblical interpretati on that in essence, sought to create a “spiritual master race” of “godly seed” completely in step–and never wavering from–his definitions of family, purity, “wisdom”, etc.

    My parents, like you, attended the seminar as young Christians and found all sorts of “applicable” lessons, so they kept on attending. Ended up being like the frogs in the warming pot who don’t know when to jump out… by the mid-80’s Gothard had a homeschool curriculum that, when followed as he desired it to be, meant that families were basically at his bidding… and any problems within the family were blamed on not following his principles correctly.

    Here’s a few links to check out. Yes, Matthew was atypical of practically ANY group outside prison walls. But the damage of growing up knowing that you are soley a means to an end, anywhere, hurts… intertwine those laws with the conditional love of the only God who can “save” you, and hope is all but the only four-letter word you don’t say.

    http://indep endentspirit lugins/links _page/links. php?cat.2

    http://www.b atteredsheep .com/gothard .html

    http://indep endentspirit hp

  5. X-er,

    That’s entirely possible. Thanks for the links. I guess I just knew when to jump out of the pot. :^)

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